|Gabi_Texi||By the way, how does religion affect the character's sueism?|
|Neptune||As far as I can tell, that's a rather blatant Sue, especially because, as far as I know, vampires in the Harry Potter world are just dark creatures (I suppose they could be like werewolves, but I haven't seen any indication of that, and they're classified as dark creatures in one of the companion books, unless I'm not remembering properly (all the HP sites are blocked by the school computers, or I'd check the lexicon)). You can't wear Hot Topic clothes in Hogwarts; there's a uniform, and it's a black robe (or I suppose you could go with the movie uniform if you were writing movieverse, but that's still not Hot Topic). She wants all the cool mystery of being a vampire without teeth which would mess it up. She angsts over her beauty, which as we all know must be a horrible affliction (sarcasm), and while I have never read about her, cutting is often used by Sue writers to display angst, and is rarely done correctly.|
But with a name like that, I'd be pondering if she was a troll. That's the most over-the-top Sue name I've read outside of a parody (assuming it's not a troll).
|Neptune||Oh, as for religion (didn't see the second page, sorry ^^;), it's all about portraying it realistically. If the author is just using, say, Wicca, just because he/she thinks that's a cool religion and is getting all the facts wrong, that might be a Sue alert. Also, if the character is very religious and this makes them perfect and above all other characters because of their religious convictions (I remember reading a Sailor Moon Christian!fic where Serena prayed for, and got, a dress), then that also might make the character a Sue.|
There aren't any specific things which are auto Sues (although naming your character after yourself comes pretty close, and I've never seen someone pull it off without it being a Sue). It's when a bunch of different Sue characteristics crop up that the character becomes a Mary Sue.
|Gabi_Texi||I see... That's what most people tell me, and I'm trying to make it as realistic as possible. As for Ebony, you can find a link her story (you can flame or whatever) on the "Mary Sue" article on Wikipedia... along with my own story...|
As for the character's religion, his name is Marco Andrija, and he's Jewish, along with his family. I think a religion other than the more weird ones should be taken seriously (Note: I said "should").
You think Marco's a possible Mary Sue?
|Nessrox444||I read that list of mary sue traits here http://www.onlyfiction.net/marysue2.html and I noticed quite a few things. See even if you have a lot of these people won't stop watching/reading because I compared these traits to Ichigo from Bleach (he's stronger than others and was able to beat a lieutenant without any formal training, his spirit energy his unique and stronger, he feelts guilty about his mom's death, the list goes on) so this won't automatically make people not like your writing.|
|facia||But, a character can have mary sue characteristics without being irredeemable. I watched some of Bleach and, it's good but I was kinda rolling my eyes at bits where he came off as a mary sue. It wasn't that it worked, it was that the rest of it worked so I put up with the mary sue bits.|
Overall, he's a okay character, but I wouldn't be so quick to say that means you shouldn't avoid the same in your own writing. Personally, I'd have liked Ichigo a lot better without him having super-ultra-always-win spirit energy. It wouldn't make me automatically not like a story about him...but, it would make me not like that part.
If you know a trait is seen as mary sueish, it's probably best to avoid it.
|PikaBot||"But, a character can have mary sue characteristics without being irredeemable. I watched some of Bleach and, it's good but I was kinda rolling my eyes at bits where he came off as a mary sue."|
That's what turned me off after the very first episode. The dude was such a BLATANT stu, and none of the rest of it blew me away.
|JesusKetchum31||If Ichigo is a Stu, so is every other Shonen hero. At least he's not emo like Shinji Ikari from Eva or Renton Thurston from Eureka Seven. Stus and Sues wouldn't exist if they weren't culturally needed. It's all a matter of how they're executed, and where.|
I try not to watch bleach because of the scattered cast and weird plot arcs, but... eh.
|facia||Some of the stuff in Bleach is just shonen genre convention but a lot of shonen stories do often have stuish characters because the author...well, isn't perfect. Ichigo having the whole ghost-seeing bit, and super strength, etc, etc, in the first episode is definitely just a shonen convention, and, they did introduce plenty of other characters with the same sorts of abilities. But, Ichigo having the super unbelievable spirit energy that dwarfs everyone else by about a thousand times....is pretty stuish and wasn't needed.|
Or simply, don't say it's good writing just because it's been written. (Bleach's level of characterization isn't much to aspire toward, anyway...)
(And since when is Shinji a typical shonen hero OR a stu? Shinji is...well...you're pretty screwed up when you're begging a catatonic girl to help you. And when you then...Shinji had issues.)
|JesusKetchum31||Shinji isn't a stu, he's a sue. :p|
Shonen series are full of obnoxiously powerful characters though. At least with Bleach it's been put out there up front without completely blowing the mystery of why. If you compare Bleach to the most analagous shonen series that's somewhat popular that I can think of, Shaman King... Ichigo is a pretty well-rounded character compared to say, Yoh.
I don't find Bleach to be especially well-written, but I don't find it to be bad either. And personally, I don't want every series I want to be the epitome of good writing. That's just as unrealistic as a Sue or Stu.