Categories > Anime/Manga > Naruto
Eroninja
During his training trip, Naruto is given a scroll which holds the secrets in how to seduce and ensnare women. A scroll he uses at first on the women and kunoichi around him but soon on the Shinob...
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Reviews
Eroninja
(#) xXNarutoXx 2017-07-30
Read 86 chapters in less then 9 days very entertaining Love your work.Eroninja
(#) Grayfoxx 2017-08-26
Hello Lemon,
There's a lot of really impressive story telling in this fic. I enjoyed a great deal of it. I read it all in one go. It took me three weeks but I read everything that's currently posted and besides being equal parts exhausted and lascivious, I'm really glad I did. Seriously, there were many late nights where I was like, "just one more chapter.....Shit! It's already morning?!" Needless to say my budget for coffee this month is in the red.
I really loved the world you created/expanded... when I understood it. Truthfully, I've mainly read the manga and skipped the filler episodes in the show, so I had to look up some of the characters and countries/villages you'd use so I can get a mental picture. I really loved how you created significant conflict. The bad guys don't just serve the purpose of evil for evils sake. I just mean, they have their reasons. You do a really good job fleshing it out. Since I read this whole thing through, it felt a little repetitive at times but if I was starting from the first time you posted, I'm sure I'd forget many of the finer points and need the reminders.
It must be tough finding/balancing so many female motivations and personalities not to mention filling their history with the right amount of pulp, but you do it well. It makes sense why the Family would love and cherish him. Though I must say that such a man is easily unbelievable. It's not a big deal but it is a little hard to swallow that one guy can remember the birthdays, anniversary's, habits/kinks/traits of over SIXTY women. Do the women remember the same info for each member? You(the author) seem to take pride in explaining how something that's unbelievable can be believable, which is great, and while sometimes I can get behind it by thinking, "well, Naruto is just special," there are times when I feel it's just not feasible. It doesn't spoil the story for me but it's not impressive either. I can believe one guy can satisfy upwards of sixty women much easier than I can get behind him being perfect at maintaining all sixty-something of them. I suppose it's a hard balance to attain and then maintain, especially as you add more women. But again, it doesn't really ruin the story for me.
What does have me rolling my eyes is Naruto's philosophy. Now, this is just my opinion and I don't in any way mean to be cruel or hostile by expressing my thoughts. Ignore me if you like. I will say that your Naruto and his philosophy isn't inspiring. From the moment he chose his family over everything, even innocent lives, to the point he accepts that he's a selfish man to Moegi, he lost my consideration. What I mean by that is that he is a great head of his family but a terrible leader of a village. And that is disappointing because that is an every man for himself mentality. I don't mean to say Naruto won't help someone in need if he can, but given the choice between an innocent civilian/shinobi or one of his family members, it's clear he'll choose his family member. I think that's normal, and that there's nothing wrong with that... unless that same person also preaches that he want to bring the villages all together in harmony. Then I take issue with that. Because how am I suppose to follow someone who cares more about his family members than the whole. Again, I don't think it's wrong to care more about your house than everyone else, but I would never follow that guy. I can't trust that his decisions will my best interests at heart.
So I totally agree with Garaa. Because in that horrendous double date, Naruto said the magic words. He said he doesn't care about the Suna citizens. Truthfully, he doesn't seem to care about Konoha citizens either. Not when he has a chance to make his lovers happier than they already are. The citizens just happen to be in his safe zone. Garaa can't possibly place any faith in Naruto after that realization because Garaa has more than one responsibility. He's Garaa of the sand AND he's the bloody Kazekage. And that job means he's responsible for more people than his immediate loved ones. He has to think about Suna citizens he's probably never even met before, but as long as they call Sunagekure home, he'll watch over them to the best of his ability. This doesn't mean that I don't think the Alliance is built on shaky ground and NEEDS members that actually unite under the spirit of the union as much as the word it's written word. I totally think Konoha and Suna should shake out the wrong elements within Kumo but for Naruto to do it just so one of his lovers can be even happier than she already is, is selfish to a dangerous degree.
Also let me add that it's not like Yugito was unhappy in Kumo. She had the respect of the people, didn't she? She was with Naruto right? His dick rocked her world repeatedly, didn't it? She has a large family and support system that accepts her, correct? Than her life couldn't have been THAT bad. Sometimes you made it sound like she was miserable and needed to escape. Which is why, should they happen to go to war, the second some innocent son, or daughter, mother, or father, dies, on either side of the divide, because of the combination of Naruto's irrational selfishness and the Raikages mercenary narcissism... the second that happens, Naruto and his choices will be just as bad as Minatos. Only this time, instead of Kushina being sacrificed, it'll be someone Naruto doesn't even know. Minato may have put the village before his family but Naruto putting his family first could lead down the same path. Again, this is ONLY if some innocent person dies not knowing the real reason why. Think about that. Garaa having to inform a family that their loved one died for his village and the Alliance all the while know the reason, in part, was cause because Naruto wanted one of his lovers to be even happier. That would suck.... and truthfully I'd hate Naruto for making me do that.
On a side note, you're ragging on Minato a lot... like a lot! I'm not saying I don't agree with some of your points, I just feel that you bring it up too much. I mean, I get. Minato sucks at choosing his family first. It's making Naruto sound like some petulant child who hates his daddy simply because he's not the center of his universe. Minato made a bad/hard/wrong choice. I get it but there's no sense in constantly beating a dead horse and then bragging about it.
Now, I get that it must be hard to walk the thin line of your own vs your neighbor. So far, Naruto is very much of the ''my own matter more'' mentality, even though I know he'll save someone who needs it or protect a village who's getting attacked. But to anyone that's not in his family, that is in dire need of saving, I just hope one of his lovers isn't in jeopardy at that exact time because it's not hard to believe you are S.O.L. then.
"There's no saving you if one of mine needs me more," Naruto admits painfully but truthfully.
I know it's ridiculous to expect a person to save a stranger over a loved one if you had to choose. I know that. Superman has that problem. But if that person(I'm looking at you Naruto) has lofty dreams of uniting ALL under one, with some intention of leading the flock so as to not go astray, than he should also think about the well being of those that are not in his immediate circle. That's what being responsible for the many is about, whether it's the captain of a team, the head of a clan, the Kage of a village or the Daimyo of a country.
It's not like Naruto and the Fam couldn't have made other plans to shake up the Raikage's stubborn ways. Karui becoming the next Kage would have been the best solution if not a little longer down the line. I mean it's not like defecting was an immediate concern. There was no plans/hints of Yugito's impending demise. They're immortal and you're telling me they can't wait a couple decades? I agree shaking up Kumo into coming around and really embracing the spirit of the Alliance should happen, but in my opinion, nearly causing war by supporting Yugito defecting, which could lead to innocent lives being sacrificed was unnecessary and put Naruto and his Family in a negative light for me. Naruto knows it's selfish, right? Is he going to continue thinking that's okay? Lee is right, even if Naruto can't see it. IF the end result be conflict, innocent blood shed WILL not only be on Naruto's hands but Yugito's, the Family's and the Raikage's hands as well. They are all culpable and I don't expect Naruto to be so cavalier about it.
Just out of curiosity, do people enjoy the Kiba/Aeris/Yuffie chapters? I don't mind one way or another. I think it's funny that even though Naruto has more lovers than Kiba, the citizens of Konoha seem to just accept Kiba having multiple lovers. While I don't mind Kiba's elevation and this is your story(which means nothing I say really matters) I thought Konohamaru would spend more time with Naruto, or at least more than Kiba. I would've also enjoyed a Neji or Lee friendship.
I don't know what you would do with this, f anything, but I like how Neji feels weird with Hinata. I don't mean to imply that there is something there but I liked that more than the Kiba stuff. Not that I dislike Kiba, I'm just indifferent.
I know you've reinforced the Clones don't feel quite the same as the original but I personally believe you should use them with the ladies more. It doesn't make sense that girl number 60 has to wait what's likely hours for some quimsticking when the Fam have their orgies. It's like a Deli Store with one of those ticket number machines. If you have an itch for some deep dicking and happen to get number 65, you might as well take a nap or do laundry cuz it's going to be a while. At least use the Clones to prep his ladies, you know? I must say, I did enjoy Kurenai's induction. That was crazier than any of the other girls in my opinion. If they had a family album that's also like a school year book, Kurenai should get the title for hottest initiation. She should get a pin. I know Naruto has the stamina and semen capacity of a god but I still don't think 3 or 8 or 20 or 50 of the girls should have to wait when the beau can literally create exact copies of himself. And if they don't feel 100% as good as the original, it's okay because Naruto is working his way through the line.
I've come to grips with the whole pregnancy issue. But I do feel that out of more than 60 women, none of them wanting to be mothers is a statistical impossibility. They may not have desires to be mothers right away or even in a hundred years, but I'm sure eventually some may want to be mothers. How perfect does the world have to be before Naruto is okay with being a father? It's hard to imagine growing up without conflict. It's not like his children will be forced to be in the Hunger Games or something.
Also, They might as well register the Uzumaki Clan and send word far and wide to any remaining Uzumaki that their clan is revived. WHo knows what kind of characters that would attract. I know he has his Family but what if there are other Uzumaki out there who might be suffering. If it's not a hard thing to do, shouldn't he at least provide his kin with some safety from what could be a cruel or hard life?
I would think Kushina or Yuugao or Mito or Naruko would learn the Hiraishin before Tenten would. She's an odd choice for the Thunder God Technique to me. What's the point of having her teleport close to the danger when as a range fighter, she'll then have to move away so she can fight from a distance? I'm sure you have your reasons but still, Tenten wouldn't have been my first pick. For Tenten, I would've given her a crazy wicked summon like Yojimbo from Final Fantasy. Totally fits in my eyes.
Ultimately I really enjoy this story. I got it on my alerts. I'm glad I'll be able to return to a normal sleep cycle. And again, if my thoughts seemed offensive in any way, I do apologize about that. I've been told I have a soft voice which allows me to get away with being real blunt in RL but doesn't translate well in the written word. Anyway, thank you for your hard work and your dedication. As a reader I appreciate it very much and will continue reading your work. Thanks again.
--AbbyAuthor's response
Thank you for the review. I'm glad you've enjoyed the story thus far, and do hope you continue to do so.
I don't find it hard to balance the women's motivations. Since for me, one of the most important when writing this story was making sure the characters had reasons to actually be in the story. As to the feasibility, well I don't really find it that hard to believe, ancient rulers had Harems numbering in the hundreds and thousands. So while I don't believe those rulers perhaps had the same connection to those women as Naruto does for his. I don't think it is hard to believe with effort you could build true relationships with them. After all, in a sense I have to keep all those women straight, and that is while holding a full time job and responsibilities that don't deal with my story.
Naturally, I disagree completely in regards to your belief Naruto is wrong in his philosophy. After all, why is the stranger due more consideration then one of his lovers? Naruto would make a terrible village leader, which is why he turned it down. I could see your argument if he had accepted becoming Hokage, but he didn't precisely because given a choice he would chose a family member over a stranger. Recognizing this, he turned the position down. To me, it is something Canon Naruto should have done, since he is a terrible family man, but supposedly a good kage. He though decided he wanted both which is why his son despises him.
I also don't agree that is an everyman for himself mentality. It is just recognizing that all people are motivated by self interest. I don't assign nobility to causes or professions. To me, a teacher might claim they do what they do to educate the next generation. But in truth they're in it for the money just like the barista at Starbucks. They demonstrate this every time their unions go on strike because they claim they aren't making enough. Aren't they hurting the children by denying them the education they say is their driving motivation for becoming a teacher? Are they not using the children as props to drain more money from the system? Shouldn't the teaching be its own reward if they claim it is when not asking for more money? Ultimately, I prefer people would be honest with their motivations rather than trying to sound nobler then they really are. If you are going to strike until you're paid more, thereby denying the children their education then money is what is really motivating these teachers.
With that said, Naruto's goal to bring the villages together in harmony is born out a selfless spirit. He first started to make his teacher happy, which in turn would make him happy. Yet as he progressed, forward adding women from new places, it became about their happiness, which in turn makes him happy. Thus why would he allow them to suffer for the sake of strangers. So they'll go around and call him a hero, sure that would make sense if much like canon Naruto being recognized by the masses is his motivation. Thus his children in canon are a secondary concern as he goes about making sure he is a beloved Kage. They're both motivated by what makes them happy, and are actively pursuing it. Just because one's goal is to unite the shinobi world doesn't mean he is giving up his claim to be able to enjoy such a world as everyone else.
Furthermore, it should be under his terms this Happy world is achieved. Why? Because he is the one that is doing the work, along with his lovers. Must people, the ones you believe he should let Yugito suffer for, are if not happy by the current world are at least content with it as they do nothing to move things forward on their own. Thus what right do they have to dictate the conditions under which it is achieved? If a person wants a say in how things are done, then they should do something to effect the outcome. Taking myself for example, I despised the direction the Naruto manga was taking, and ultimately the lack of thought your average lemon fic displayed. Thus I created this story to have a say, and because of that the only person that will be completely satisfied by it is going to be me. I do it because I enjoy writing, but also because I want reviews. But, if I just sit back and complained then I would just have to accept the canon story and unoriginal lemon fics. By taking action, I alone expect the greatest reward at the end. Hopefully the readers will enjoy it as much as me, but I expect some will say, not a bad story, but I would have done X or Y. Thus, much like a teacher, Cop, soldier, or Hokage, I expect everyone takes to the tasks they set for themselves with some sort of reward expected for the effort. For me, a part of that reward are reviews such as this which I really enjoy.
After all, saying that man wants to unit the world doesn't mean the man himself is virtuous. Hitler wanted to as well I imagine. Thus to me, the complaint that because Naruto prioritizes his family he shouldn't take up the cause, to me is a complaint stemming from a belief that a person doing nothing to effect the outcome deserves the same reward as the person doing the heavy lifting. I don't agree with that because I think people deserved to be rewarded for their efforts, not just lounging around.
Thus to me, agreeing with Gaara might prove rather foolhardy if you don't consider his motivations for his beliefs. For example, what if his being a Kage is solely about his own redemption. Thus by being willing to sacrifice Sari for the benefit of the masses it is solely about his trying to forgive himself for his earlier rampages which he gauges through gaining the affection of the village. Wouldn't you agree that even as the people of Suna are benefiting his actions that they are wholly self-serving, just like Naruto? To me, the truly virtuous thing is one of them is being honest about it. After all, I believe in the individual over the collective. The collective can be just as self serving as a person, but a person rarely gets the same slack the collective gives itself.
After all, people that believe in the collective over the individual will defend things like the Uchiha Massacre. You yourself are okay with Yugito being essentially a slave for Kumo, because she is kept in a gilded cage, and to address that would disrupt the collective. But wouldn't an individual that recognizes that they are in a cage still yearn for freedom. Isn't is selfish of the collective to demand her to stifle that yearning for its own benefit, or is it acceptable because there are more people that benefit from her remaining where she is. To me, the collective is thinking of itself just as much as Naruto, they just use their superior numbers as justification for their selfishness.
The reason I'm ragging on Minato so much are precisely because of comments like this. I don't agree with the choice Minato made and I don't think the Naruto I believed in would either once he realized his father turned him into a weapon at the expense of his mother. Remember the Naruto that claimed he wasn't going to be a tool for the shinobi system, well he died in the manga, but here he is alive and well. His mother and him were used as tools, why shouldn't he be upset about it? Moreover, he's upset about it in a world that kisses Minato's ass for turning him into one. Comments like yours just prove it is an uphill battle among readers, imagine if you held that opinion in the village of Konoha.
As to the comment about needing saving with one of his lovers are on the line. To be honest I feel that is the case with everyone, after all aren't there plots where a villain will kidnap a loved one to make the hero betray a duty. Would it really be virtuous if he let them die to stay true to random strangers. To me, that is a lose, lose situation and ultimately it comes down to what consequences a person in that situation can live with. But neither choice makes him more virtuous except in the eyes of the people that benefited or were hurt by his decision, which if it is the collective usually would see his chosing it over the family member as being the more heroic. The family member might be willing to forgive him for failing them knowing the pressure that he was under.
For the clones, I just don't mention it because I focus on the original and the women he is with. But, it isn't hard to imagine they are used in a variety of ways.
As to pregnancy, well consider that a sign of the collective in regards to the family. After all, one of the reasons Naruto didn't target Shion earlier was because she wanted him to give her a child. Ultimately, I feel women that join the Family do find that bringing a child into it would be rather disruptive, giving them even less access to Naruto then they already receive.
Yes, there probably are as Karin and him can attest. But, why is it his responsibility to provide a safe haven for a clan that he was never a part of and has been defunct since before he was born? Perhaps future events though will show that this might be something worth considering...
To me, Tenten makes a better choice as it follows the progress I've made with her character. She's been training with Tsunade since joining the Family, she doesn't need to retreat to fight at a distance. Plus, her mastery of seals and her perfect aim would make her a threat to deliver a kunai exactly where it needs to be. The others are all skilled already, or will grow in different ways.
Thank you again. I didn't take offense by your comments and hope mine aren't either. I appreciate your bluntness because it conveys an honesty that most people go out of their way to avoid. Thank you again.
Sincerely, The Lemon Sage.Eroninja
(#) Grayfoxx 2017-08-28
Hello again LemonSage!
Thank you for responding! It's always nice to actually get a response because I always feel writers must be super busy. So to take time out of your day to respond is very kind and awesome. I'll keep this one short.
I agree with a lot of your points. I just want to say a few things for clarity. My initial statement on Naruto's philosophy, while I don't completely agree with all of it depending on who his actions are for, has more to do with how lackluster it is as a reader than anything else. He has reasons for his actions and they are good and understandable reasons as a character but they don't inspire/impress/motivate a reader(well, maybe just me, really... not that you have to). His philosophy and my personal issue with it has more to do with the story-to-audience relationship. Your Naruto is special because of his impressive world changing goals and the family/connections he creates along the way no matter the conflict. As a reader I enjoy that. But then he undercuts that thing that makes him special for exclusivity.
"I want to change the world, but only if it benefits my family," yelled Commander Uzumaki. "Hail Fox! Hail Fox! Hail Fox!" (lol)
You've established that everyone in your world only looks out for their own interests. Minato, Ay, Gaara sacrifice close people/loved ones for their ends, either for the collective or not. Naruto is doing the exact same thing. It's the opposite side of the same coin. Why is it okay to trash them for sacrificing close loved ones but not Naruto for sacrificing strangers? (I'll get to sacrificing strangers in a minute) It's a contradiction and not necessarily because Naruto doesn't have good reasons for his actions but because we, as an audience, already have proof of what a hero/interesting person is. "I want to change the world, and I'm going to do it in a way you've never seen before." That sounds more like an interesting character. As strong and as family-oriented as Naruto is, he's no different than any regular guy watching out for themselves and their house with the sacrifice coming from outside his house. As a regular anybody it's not hard to be selfish and Naruto is doing that--the easy thing. As an audience/reader I personally just don't associate that mentality with someone interesting. And I'm using the word "interesting" and not "hero," because as an audience/reader I care more about 'interesting' characters than what it means to be a 'hero'.
Also, if we dive into your world, would Tenten have been as good or as inspired to be a great kunoichi without her heroes, like Mito and Tsunade(Both of whom don't see themselves as heroes). And maybe Tsunade and Mito aren't heroes but they should be able to understand that others--whether they be your seniors or peers or the younger up and coming generations--will look to them/their strength as a source of inspiration. Naruto may not be cool with the burden of the title hero, but is it cool to just tell people or kids who may have hopes to do and be better, "Well, I'm not a hero, so sorry, look somewhere else." To me, the Naruto that put it all on the line to rescue Kin is much more interesting than the Naruto that said the Suna people don't matter more than Yugito's optimum happiness. Those are two different Naruto's to me.
I was a fat kid that grew up to be a fat adult. I'm ashamed to admit I didn't have the mental fortitude to change... until I met that one guy who not only inspired me but told me he was the same way. What I'm trying to say is that sometimes people need their heroes/inspirations because deep down people do want to change for the better. So when you have a great candidate like Naruto imposing all these wonderful changes in the world to then turn around and say these strangers don't matter to me... well, it's disappointing. And that's what I, as a reader, feel sometimes with your main character when he says stuff like that. Disappointment. That's why Naruto's philosophy, in my eyes, will be hard to convince, if not many, than at least myself.
I will say this. I firmly believe that we can't all be special or leaders, or kings or heads of clans. The workers and followers are just as important as the ones leading them. After all, what's a king without followers? A soup without ingredients? I mean it's kinda hard to buy groceries if no one's farming it. Kinda hard to be smart if there are no teachers to teach. Pretty easy to be a criminal when there are no police to fight injustice. Society needs these people to function and prosper as a whole. A 'One for All,' kind of deal. A single person smart enough to create farming techniques, that yield more crops, that feed craftsman so they can focus on their services or product, that stimulates more commerce and businesses, all of whom are taxed which then funds government, who in turn focus their wealth on programs like shinobi, and teachers, and police and so on. One affects the group. These are the people who suffer the most when Naruto wants one of his lovers to be happier than she already is, in turn making him happier. And while Naruto is not evil, he is a self proclaimed selfish person who apparently has no problems being upfront about that. And should some young, impressionable shinobi utilize Naruto's philosophy, he will likely end up being just as selfish in their choices as Naruto. So then who watches out for the little guy keeping society going, farming out crops or teaching our kids? We need those people. It's not like Naruto has a bunch of clones working the fields for the food they eat. Naruto is benefiting from the services of others just like they benefit from him. Yet Naruto is cool with nearly starting a war that would put these peoples lives in jeopardy all for his selfish happiness? Thank goodness we have people like Gaara and Minato, because clearly someone like Naruto thinks the collective just isn't worth it or is of little consequence compared to his loved ones. It's funny because if Naruto applied his philosophy to the whole--i mean everyone, whether he sleeps with them or not--than it would be inspiring and interesting because everyone's happiness is his happiness. And that's hard to pull off when there's conflict.
I don't care if you do it for the passion, you should still get paid. Ideally well enough to live off of. Teaching and other jobs with similar salary wages are not lofty jobs, especially when you can be the leader or head or kage or something cool like that. But someone has to do it. Teachers strike because they are the little people and unfortunately it's all too easy to take advantage of the little people. Do you think they shouldn't get paid? It may be their passion but they're still providing a service to society. And one might argue a very important one. I'm surprised people even want to be teachers with the shitty salary they have. I thought Naruto was getting paid for all the missions he does. Is that not the case? Has he been doing all his missions for free? I imagine taking out Kanji was free, but I thought most of the other stuff saw a direct deposit of some sort.
If Naruto doesn't like the expectations/views placed on him by society why doesn't he just leave society? I would argue that he is just as caged as Yugito. A tool just like Yugito. A jinchuuriki just like Yugito. Yet you don't see him defecting. How is Ay is supposed to be cool with Konan asking and expecting him to give her reinvented Akatsuki an active member of his nations military?? If Konan, hell, if any group that used to be a bad organization and now good, came to Tsunade and asked her to let them have Naruto, are you telling me she, as the Hokage, would be okay with that? We as the audience as well as Gaara know that Konan and her Akatsuki are on the up and up, but the Raikage doesn't know that. How is Ay suppose to trust a recently flipped organization with one of his strongest shinobi? Kumo is a military state right? Does Yugito's position allows her to pick and choose assignments and that's why she's pissed Ay won't let her go? It's absolutely true that the Raikage acted like a dick and even hostile, but he's still in the right. If Konan asked a non active kumo shinobi to join her group, I could understand that but Yugito is still active. It is entirely the decision of the commanding officer to allow one of his soldiers to join in a newly formed combat unit or not. If I was the Raikage, I would've said, "Sorry. Tactically it doesn't make sense to weaken our military force by giving you one of my strongest shinobi. I'll consider lending her to you but in the mean time I can only publicly give your Akatsuki my support and even petition any non active kumo shinobi who would like to join but that is all I can do." That is reasonable response and hard to refute but the end result is still Yugito not going. Would she then still defect if he had said that? You say she's caged but she didn't feel that way until the meeting nothing really changed but the perspective. The blinders may be gone but she's still running the same race. But whatever if you say Yugito was miserable even though she still has an exceptional lover and supportive family, than who am I to say otherwise.
The Uzumaki Clan returns! I don't mean to say it's his responsibility. I purposely put the words, "if it's not a hard thing to do," precisely for that reason. I'm not saying Naruto NEEDS to be the one to do it, though it seems borderline lazy not to. If anything I only bring it up cuz it's odd for me to believe someone who is all about family draws a hard line against simply reaching out to the fractured and distant clan of his kin. He doesn't need to have some altruistic motivation for it. In my mind it's a simple registration at the council building and then mailing out a notice to major cities or villages. If that's too difficult for Naruto to do than at least outsource it. Does Fuka, or Mito, or Kushina not care as much as Naruto and apparently Karin do? You've racked up quite a few Uzumaki already, yet other, scattered Uzumaki don't seem to be important to them... them... the same group that call themselves, The Family. It just seems like a logical next step to fill out some paper work, and mail out some invitations. Unless you're saying it'll take more effort than that. If it does, i'd like to read it.
Is there a ranking for our kunoichi? A lineup of strength or battle capability? Like Tenten has been training with Tsunade, so is she now as strong or stronger than Yuugao or any of the bijuu? While I have no doubt Tenten will be even stronger with the Thunder God technique than she already is, she's still a weapons specialist using a technique that pairs really well with close range taijutsu or ninjutsu. I remember in the Manga when Minato fought Tobi and used his technique, totally whooping him. I just have a hard time seeing Tenten doing something like that... which is my fault really. I don't have a great imagination or I'm too hung up on their specialties to be convinced otherwise.
Shit! This got longer than I intended. Thank you again for responding! That's always super cool of authors. No need to respond to this unless you want to. If you do, know I'll totally appreciate it! Thank you and keep up the stellar work.
P.S. I did lose the weight and now I'm nearly yoked!
--AbbyAuthor's response
You’re welcome.
I can’t really say that I agree that it makes my Naruto more lackluster. To me, it would be in finding out that a character isn’t what he says he is. Canon Naruto made many promises, and what do we find out in the end, but that he was just a politician that had no problem making promises, that he had no intention of keeping. Moreover, his manipulations extended to people we thought he cared for like Sakura who he was after only to win points in his rivalry with Sasuke. I would have preferred knowing this in the beginning as then I and I imagine many people wouldn’t have followed this series. I don’t think Naruto’s goals are what makes him impressive, but his character. To me, the person that was willing to fight against being a tool in a world that viewed shinobi as disposable weapons is far more interesting, as it speaks to his character. People wanting to unite the world are a dime a dozen, and as mentioned before goals don’t say much about the person trying to achieve them. A man trying to cure cancer to become rich has a noble goal, even if his reason for doing it isn’t all that noble. So, what does his goal say about him? To me, nothing. It’s how he carries himself that matters.
I don’t agree that Naruto is the same as them, because he isn’t in a position of power within his government. Granted, he is a power behind the scenes, but when he bounds someone to him, to me it is akin to his taking marriage vows. A part of those vows is to hold your partners above all others. He is honoring that vow that he made to his lovers. To me, people make promises all the time without considering the ramifications of them. Naruto could say the same in the beginning, with his statement that he would always do right by his lovers. It would be the easy thing to now break it, because to not do so might cause negative consequences. Far harder is to continue to honor it.
Besides which, if he did begin to treat his lovers as a means to an end. What is the incentive for the next woman to join him. If he just says flowery words to get them in his bed, then he is a charlatan, Much as canon Naruto turned out to be. To me, the more interesting character is the one that stands by his vow, after all, he never promised the civilians of Konoha, Kumo, and Suna that he was going to change the world. He did promise the women that he has chosen to help him, and also promised them to, “Always do right by them.” I can’t really help it if you decide to focus on his overall goal as something to assign nobility to as opposed to his words and actual promises.
As far as heroes go, well Charles Barkley once famously said, “I’m not a role model.” To me, while it is still fine to look up to him as a great basketball player. That doesn’t mean he needs to comport himself in any manner then how he wants to live, in order to meet any expectation some fan has for him. He is entitled to live his life anyway he wants, and just because people look up to him it doesn’t give them the right to force him to act a certain way to meet our expectations. Canon Naruto doesn’t meet mine after all, does that mean Kishimoto needs to change him to meet what I expected him to be? Of course not, so neither should Tsunade and Mito change or act a certain way to meet Tenten’s. It is there life to live how they want.
Naruto in my story is merely being honest when he states he isn’t going to sacrifice the happiness of his lovers for the happiness of strangers, so while that might disappoint you. Ultimately, to me it is better to live with disappointment then to buy into a false idol who tells you the right things while not meaning any of them. Because as your personal story can attest to, while you met someone that inspired you to improve yourself. I believe it was because he meant the words he told you. So how would it feel to find out that what he said was just rubbish to get you to change as he couldn’t accept you the way you were? Because, to me, if Naruto starts treating his lovers as props to advance his goal, then everything he said to them to get them to join them would have been lies.
While I agree that not everyone floats to the top, most of the examples you listed are born to their positions. Kings, and Head of Clans in particular are mostly hereditary positions. Moreover, just because a person is a farmer doesn’t mean they aren’t a leader in many other aspects of life, be it their local community or family. Yes, society does indeed need them, but does that mean they would agree to be sacrificed for society. What if society felt it had too many farmers and decided to take someone’s land to build a factory. Should that farmer just meekly accept having his land stolen because society as a whole demands it. Screw that, why should he surrender his land for strangers that have decided without considering his wants and desires that he shouldn’t be a farmer anymore. If you’re willing to surrender your freedoms to appease society, then don’t be surprised when society doesn’t ask your permissions when it decides to oppress you.
I never said that was the only factor Naruto considered when he decided to help Yugito flee Kumo. But it was the primary one yes. The other factor was that Yugito was essentially a slave of the shinobi system. After all, as a babe she had a weapon sealed inside her and no thought or consideration was given to her wants and desires. Having developed a desire to join Akatsuki, why should she surrender it because Kumo decided to make her a weapon? Because society demanded it, society was what turned her into a weapon in the first place. How can Naruto hope to change society, if he refuses to push back against it where he believes it is wrong. The first step was striping Ay of one of his weapons that made him so confident about his position in society. Gaara and Minato sacrificed those closest to them to protect society, then what purpose does society serve if not to protect those we care for. What if the solution Minato came up with for stopping the kyuubi meant everyone in the village needed to sacrifice one person they cared for, would you be okay with that? Who would you give up? The person that inspired you to change yourself. Would their life be worth trading to stop some calamity or would you seek a better alternative? Are the people that say the price is too high just being selfish? To me, Minato wasn’t selfless because he roped his child and wife into his sacrifice. Neither were obliged to be sacrifices so Minato could create a weapon to be pointed at Konoha’s enemies. Kushina was even willing to sacrifice herself to deal with the Kyuubi and that would have been selfless. He had another option, but wanted a weapon so used up his wife and son. That isn’t a hero to me just because society benefitted. After all, only society would say sacrificing a child was a good thing because it was saved as a result.
The medium salary for teachers is $45,000 across the USA. By me, the median annual salary for a school teacher is close to $60,000. I think that puts most well in the middle class with benefit packages that can go into the high six figures. The idea that teachers are underpaid is laughable as far as I’m concerned. I feel that if teaching is their passion, then the job should be reward enough. But, if they desire more money, then they should be willing to move to a district where they can get paid more. Instead, they use the children in their care as hostages denying them an education until their demands are met. Furthermore, through this bargaining you aren’t allowed to pay good teachers better than bad teachers, meaning there is no incentive to excel at the profession allowing most to coast through regardless of how prepared the students that they turn out are. You’re right Naruto does get paid to go on missions, just as Minato was paid to be Hokage, and Iruka was paid to be a teacher. But what if Naruto didn’t want to be a shinobi any more, would society let him? Was he ever given a choice to be anything but one much as Yugito?
I would agree that Naruto is as caged as Yugito by his circumstances, which were forced on him by his father by the way, especially if he wanted to be anything but a shinobi. Thus don’t you think a sign that he is making progress would be if he could eventually walk away from being one. As to Yugito, if she was free then wouldn’t it be her choice whether or not she should be allowed to join Akatsuki. It wasn’t as if she was given a choice to be a jinchuriki in the first place. As a jinchuriki is she ever going to be allowed to be inactive, or upon her becoming such would they just yank the bijuu out of her, killing her in the process, and place it into someone else. If you were the Raikage, you would also have authorized the kidnapping of Hinata to try and bolster his military. Furthermore, if you succeeded what would you do if she wanted to go home someday? But, to me you seem to be arguing his choices are okay because he can justify that his society benefits from them. I understand why he wouldn’t want to, but he was never going to allow Yugito to live a life that she wanted. Furthermore, Yugito is a person not an item, do you think if Ay had allowed her to go that she would have turned around and attacked her home just because Konan demanded it. If he had shown some trust in her, she would probably still have remained loyal to him. Up until she learned that he had stolen her much as he tried to Hinata. In the end, I view characters as Ay, Minato, and Gaara, as viewing people as little more than game pieces to be moved on the board rather than people with hopes and dreams of their own. As such, they spend their lives and even the lives of people close to them frivolously so long as the gain is great enough. Minato in particular had an option that would deal with the Kyuubi in the short term allowing him to plan for the long, but he decided he wanted Konoha to have a weapon as well. Thus he turned his son into one also dooming him to be a slave of society. How then in turn can Naruto justify using his lovers as pieces to be traded away in order to bring about his ambition. How can he hurt the very people that he should be wanting to benefit the most from the changes they are bringing about? To me, the only acceptable answer is that he can’t, not if he truly loves and cherishes them. At the same time, I don’t expect Society to care, but that doesn’t mean he is going to surrender to its whims. It comes down to who has the greater will to remain true to what they desire, and if society wins out, then how can Naruto possibly change it, when he is sacrificing that what he claims to care for to Society in order to appease it.
Again, what makes it his responsibility? You say it isn’t a hard thing to do, then why didn’t Mito as the wife of the First Hokage. Or Kushina as the wife of the Foruth. What makes it his responsibility? They had more ties to the Uzumaki then he ever did.
I don’t really see the characters as how strong or weak they are. I just want to showcase that they are improving themselves.
Again, thank you for taking the time to comment. Sincerely the Lemon Sage.
P.S, CongratualtionsEroninja
(#) Grayfoxx 2017-08-28
Thank you LemonSage.
And I apologize. Im just trying to understand the boarders of your logic. Like where selfishness is good and where selfishness is bad. Its odd to me because, for example, people/loved ones/shinobi Minato and Gaara would sacrifice for their selfish reasons, is somehow different than the strangers Narutos willing to sacrifice for his selfish reason. To me the end results are the same no matter the ideals behind them. Sacrfice is still sacrifice. But to you, it seems who benefits from the sacrifice and therefore is in the right lies in.... slavery? Naruto is a slave to the decisions made for him about his life, by those before him just like every single member of his Family, which then makes his selfishness okay... is that correct?
I really want to understand your side when I read your fic, so im just going to assume certain things, like, the ONLY promise that matters to Naruto is those to his lovers/family and ignore his initial goal that started all of this. Was Naruto lying when he said he wanted to unite the villages? Or did he just KINDA mean it? If i can assume Narutos lovers happiness matters more than his goal, than can i also assume his goal doesnt matter as much to the women who started and continue this journey because of it? It seems like the goal will now be optional. Does Naruto still feel like Gaara is family or has he been demoted to casual friend? For now ill assume Narutos lovers requests matter first, than anything Gaara might ask. If any of Narutos Suna lovers asked Naruto to help some random family in Sunagekura, can I assume the regular strangers will matter to him then?
I will also assume that Naruto CAN be considered a tool for his lovers happiness, because THEIR happiness is HIS happiness, correct? And that none of his lovers think the happiness of innocent strangers matter as much as theirs. Does this make Tsunade unhappy because shes a tool of the village? Or Yuugao or Komachi, basically anyone that serve the people are actually unhappy because they are apart of a shinobi system that sees a lot of loved ones die to protect weak citizens?
But Naruto himself will still stay in Konoha as a tool to be used for the collectives purposes? Does being a member of Konoha's society and it's military force NOT allow him to defect just like Yugito? Couldn't you just write that... if thats what your Naruto wants... to be free? To not be a hero? Not be a tool? Doesnt the rules and impositions placed upon him by society mean that hes just as miserable as Yugito?
I'll also try to assume money should NOT go to those who do a trade as a passion. How they will afford things and feed themselves is beyond me but as you say, its its own reward. For instance, its not Kiyomis passion to run a shipping company so its fine that she makes a lot of money, but Konan's Akatsuki IS her passion so she'll be doing it for free.
I agree with you about Ay. Hes a bad egg, that one. Its unfortunate for the Family that he is still the Raikage which means they still have to play ball with him. If he was a little more like Danzo than they could trap him and exppse it but unfortunately hes just a prick. Im not justifying the decisions he makes but wjat can they do to change him? Is that even an option?
You are the writer right? You control the story, yes? You CAN make Fuuka or Mito or Kushina care about their lost Clan if you want. But if you think our Uzumaki wouldnt actually care and you yourself may not be interested in it, than that is fine. I just thought family meant more than those in front of you.
As you can see, i may not get it. Anyway, thank again for the response. Please keep writing. Because i do enjoy more than less. Thanks.
--Abby.Author's response
Naruto hasn’t sacrificed anyone though, and that is where you seem to be running into issues. Yes, he isn’t willing to allow his lovers to suffer to insure some strangers’ happiness, but that isn’t the same as allowing those masses to suffer to insure those of his lovers. Naruto had a plan when it came to extracting Yugito, and if it failed, he would have faced the consequences of it failing. Such as turning himself over to Kumo. Would that still stop a war? Maybe or maybe not, but using the wellbeing of strangers to justify Yugito needing to remain in Kumo is not something Naruto could have done if he is going to claim to value his lovers.
Their goal is important, but at the same time using it as justifying making them suffer is not acceptable either. As I stated before, Naruto started the goal but he didn’t really realize what it would entail. He also didn’t realize how important those women would become. However, that doesn’t mean he recruited them as soldiers and thus can spend their livers frivolously. It is still the driving force, but again it doesn’t justify him sacrificing them or their happiness to achieve it.
If that is how you want to view it then be my guess. Yet, to me a defining something as a tool is often the view point of the people doing the using. To me, your collective views Naruto as a tool because it was fine for him to be turned into a weapon for their sake. His father also turned him into one because Konoha couldn’t be without its weapon. Naruto doesn’t see his lovers as tools and I don’t imagine they do him. He sees them as partners in the endeavor and partners deserve to be rewarded equally when it comes time to collect the reward for one’s actions. If the end goal is a peaceful world, then Naruto is seeking one where not just he benefits, but his partners as well. As to the masses, well if they aren’t an active part of the attaining the goal why do they deserve to benefit as much as those that did. Shouldn’t the end result be good enough, why do Naruto’s partners not suffering to make what they achieve any less rewarding for those that simply sat on their asses.
The problem I have with Minato actions, which Gaara would emulate is, do we consider sacrificing children to be a good thing or bad thing normally. Well if it normally is bad, it doesn’t suddenly become acceptable because the stakes are different. If Minato wants to sacrifice himself, then he bloody well can do so. It stops being acceptable when he decides his wife and son should be used up as well. Yet, the Collective didn’t seem to broken up about a child being turned into a weapon for their sake. Weren’t they fine with Naruto suffering for them? Was it really too much to ask that Minato find a better way to prevent a child from suffering? Is it really out of the realm of believability for Naruto to want to make Yugito’s situation better and not let the concerns of people he didn’t pledge himself to sway his decision?
Ultimately, to me it seems selfishness as defined by you is an action that a person takes which can expressly be considered to society’s benefit. But, did society care in the slightest about Naruto’s situation. No, because he was sacrificed for its benefit. Naruto would have been willing to pay the consequences for his choice if it failed to mitigate a war. He was willing to do that because he cared for Yugito, and he didn’t want to cause needless suffering. But, he couldn’t let the fear of that potential outcome stop him.
I wouldn’t say my Naruto is miserable in the slightest, because although society doesn’t care for him. He has surrounded himself with people that do, and ultimately isn’t that what motivates most people to want to make the world a better place. Not to please strangers, but those closest to you. To me, happiness is ignoring what norms society would force on you, to do what you feel is right for you. You don’t want to get married and pop out kids. Then don’t. However, isn’t that what society would demand of you in order to perpetuate it. Naruto’s goal is to make the world a better place sure, but what good is achieving it if he loses his reason for doing so along the way.Eroninja
(#) TheLemonSage 2017-08-28
Naruto hasn’t sacrificed anyone though, and that is where you seem to be running into issues. Yes, he isn’t willing to allow his lovers to suffer to insure some strangers’ happiness, but that isn’t the same as allowing those masses to suffer to insure those of his lovers. Naruto had a plan when it came to extracting Yugito, and if it failed, he would have faced the consequences of it failing. Such as turning himself over to Kumo. Would that still stop a war? Maybe or maybe not, but using the wellbeing of strangers to justify Yugito needing to remain in Kumo is not something Naruto could have done if he is going to claim to value his lovers.
Their goal is important, but at the same time using it as justifying making them suffer is not acceptable either. As I stated before, Naruto started the goal but he didn’t really realize what it would entail. He also didn’t realize how important those women would become. However, that doesn’t mean he recruited them as soldiers and thus can spend their livers frivolously. It is still the driving force, but again it doesn’t justify him sacrificing them or their happiness to achieve it.
If that is how you want to view it then be my guess. Yet, to me a defining something as a tool is often the view point of the people doing the using. To me, your collective views Naruto as a tool because it was fine for him to be turned into a weapon for their sake. His father also turned him into one because Konoha couldn’t be without its weapon. Naruto doesn’t see his lovers as tools and I don’t imagine they do him. He sees them as partners in the endeavor and partners deserve to be rewarded equally when it comes time to collect the reward for one’s actions. If the end goal is a peaceful world, then Naruto is seeking one where not just he benefits, but his partners as well. As to the masses, well if they aren’t an active part of the attaining the goal why do they deserve to benefit as much as those that did. Shouldn’t the end result be good enough, why do Naruto’s partners not suffering to make what they achieve any less rewarding for those that simply sat on their asses.
The problem I have with Minato actions, which Gaara would emulate is, do we consider sacrificing children to be a good thing or bad thing normally. Well if it normally is bad, it doesn’t suddenly become acceptable because the stakes are different. If Minato wants to sacrifice himself, then he bloody well can do so. It stops being acceptable when he decides his wife and son should be used up as well. Yet, the Collective didn’t seem to broken up about a child being turned into a weapon for their sake. Weren’t they fine with Naruto suffering for them? Was it really too much to ask that Minato find a better way to prevent a child from suffering? Is it really out of the realm of believability for Naruto to want to make Yugito’s situation better and not let the concerns of people he didn’t pledge himself to sway his decision?
Ultimately, to me it seems selfishness as defined by you is an action that a person takes which can expressly be considered to society’s benefit. But, did society care in the slightest about Naruto’s situation. No, because he was sacrificed for its benefit. Naruto would have been willing to pay the consequences for his choice if it failed to mitigate a war. He was willing to do that because he cared for Yugito, and he didn’t want to cause needless suffering. But, he couldn’t let the fear of that potential outcome stop him.
I wouldn’t say my Naruto is miserable in the slightest, because although society doesn’t care for him. He has surrounded himself with people that do, and ultimately isn’t that what motivates most people to want to make the world a better place. Not to please strangers, but those closest to you. To me, happiness is ignoring what norms society would force on you, to do what you feel is right for you. You don’t want to get married and pop out kids. Then don’t. However, isn’t that what society would demand of you in order to perpetuate it. Naruto’s goal is to make the world a better place sure, but what good is achieving it if he loses his reason for doing so along the way.
Eroninja
(#) Grayfoxx 2017-08-29
Thank you. I now feel like it wont head to war. For a while there i thought Naruto was cool with innocent lives lost as long as Yugito is happy. I guess i got bogged down by all the Minato hate, Narutos primary reason seemingly like the only reason for nearing war and not even discussing another way.
If Naruto said he would turn himself in to avoid a war than i wouldnt have thought he was soo selfish and crass.
I still dont like that comment he made about the suna people. It wasnt nice to say to the leader pf the Suna people. You realize everyone is a stranger until you get to know them?
I still think the Raikage is the problem and as long as hes the head hancho, Yugitos defection is temporary solution.
Thats it. Ill really try to see your points as i read em. Keep up the good work!
--Abby.Author's response
I believe Naruto does say in the story that he would turn himself in if things went wrong. Much as he was willing to face the fallout for his going rogue to help Gaara.
But its true, the people of Suna are Gaara's responsibility. Not Naruto, much as Gaara's responsibility wasn't to insure the wellbeing of Yugito. I don't understand why it is acceptable for Gaara to dismiss Yugito because she doesn't fall under his jurisdiction. Yet Naruto has to care for the well being of all of Suna over his lover. To me, neither is really right or wrong, they are merely stating their priorities lay in different places.
Thanks again!Eroninja
(#) Grayfoxx 2017-08-29
I guess I was thinking about the possible out come and weighing the differences between them. Since you only provided us with two; Yugito stays or Yugito defects. If she stays the worst that can happen is she's miserable until they come up with something else.... alive and sexually satisfied, but miserable nonetheless. Which I can agree is a problem that needs a solution but Naruto immediately supported defection(more on that). So the worst that could possibly happen if she leaves is the Alliance breaking down which could've lead to war and possibly innocent lives lost on all fronts, not just Suna people. I know your point of view is that even if the worst case scenario is possible, that shouldn't justify Yugito's unhappiness. It's ballsy which is what I think you were going for but even if it is, it's also callous and a slap in the face to people who DO think about the whole rather than just the individual. You may not subscribe to that philosophy but it still matters to those that do, like Tsunade, Konan, Iruka, Gaara. It's fortunate that Tsunade is doing all in her power to avoid major conflict but she still has the same job as Gaara, Konan and the Raikage. She's lucky she even has Naruto and the Family because how bad/similar could her choices have been to other kages without that support network.
Defect, or Not to Defect... Was that the only question?? I guess I just wished you/Naruto took more time to consider a third way out. After all, I'm already used to Naruto taking time to solve problems, like Ino's, Anko's, Gaara's. But for Naruto to just immediately agree to Yugito defecting not even minutes after she brings it up is surprising. You as the writer could've made the fall out a lot worse than simply having Naruto being targeted. But you didn't so I guess it turned out okay since I know Naruto won't die.
Wow, LemonSage. You've responded more times than all my other responses from other authors combined. Thank you for taking the time. I must be pretty annoying at this point. Hope all is well and keep up the good work.
--Abby.Author's response
Hi, ultimately I don't feel it breaks down to being ballsy outside of doing the right thing is more often harder than not. To me, it comes down to principles. Naruto's principles have shifted that building a better world can't come at the expense of his lovers. So, while I can understand the idea of waiting for an opportune moment, to me the people arguing for that simply don't want to disrupt their lives, and so will allow bad things to persist. For example, if someone had stood up to the nut jobs running North Korea, would we be living in a world where another tyrant has a nuke. If during the time of the Continental Congress, those against slavery had argued more passionately to end the practice, would we have needed a Civil War. If a single country had stood up to Hitler as he took Poland, would WW2 have happened. But in these cases, and many more, people decided not to act because it would be disruptive to people's lives, which for politicians is more often a bad thing which is why they act in their own self interests when deciding not to do anything, and as a result ignored doing what they felt was right.
To me, those were the only two questions that mattered. Either you leave Yugito where she is hoping Karui becomes Raikage, which is an uphill battle and can take years. Or, you solve the problem which is Yugito is unhappy being used as Kumo's weapon, and wishes to use her abilities to help in the manner Akatsuki plans to. To me, a good leader makes the bold and principled choice, not making excuses that doing the right thing now isn't the opportune time to do it. To me, the masses are never bold, thus never do the right thing until they are dragged kicking and screaming into doing it. They would gladly allow Yugito to remain where she is as the injustice done to her doesn't trump their potential suffering to fix it. To use your own argument, not everyone floats to the top which is why you need leaders willing to motivate their people in the right direction or to act boldly believing they are right in their actions, not allowing the masses inherent cowardice and collective self-interest define the proper courses of action.Eroninja
(#) Grayfoxx 2017-08-30
That is not (at all) why some, if not many, "decided" not to act, lol! If you exclude the people who take advantage of the monetary gain from war and just focus on the masses... well, have you ever been beaten up by a stronger person(s)? Have you ever been outmaneuvered by someone who is clearly more intelligent than you are? There are people in this world who can't always defend themselves. And even if the masses wanted to oppose tyranny, you know how difficult it is to lead a mass of soldiers/untrained civilians/militia against a superior military might? It's not surprising when weak people fall. It's not even surprising when strong people let it happen. Bad shit happening is never surprising, but when Naruto nearly starts bad shit, he better have a damn good reason!
"Hoping" Karui becomes Raikage??? With Naruto by her side isn't that kind of a certainty? "UPHILL BATTLE"?? Naruto laughs in the face of uphill battles. As you've said, just because it's a difficult thing to do, doesn't mean Naruto won't do it for his lovers. YEARS? They're immortal. Though I guess they'll need to live a few centuries before that can mentality really start to kick in.
Kumo's Weapon? You mean the Raikage's weapon. If Kumo citizens know anything, it's simply that she's a strong Kumo Shinobi. A shinobi who wants to be a shinobi for another origination even though it's her leader's call. Not to say shinobi don't think and feel and have personalities, but they are still a country's military force. If they don't want to be shinobi, go be something else than. Resign. I'm certain Naruto wouldn't care. But they don't want to resign do they? The only thing that's "truly" unfair about Yugito's situation is that she had NO choice. Her choice was wrongly taken from her.
They didn't handle the flower girl attack, Ay's war cry's, Danzo and Joseki the Prison threats right away did they? They didn't save Komachi right away even when they knew exactly where she was. She could've easily died. Wouldn't the bold thing to do in all these situations be to courageously risk the actions necessary without forethought of the out come? No! They took there time, and made a plan. They handled it with finesse to "truly" solve the problem with the least amount of blow back possible.
Yes the masses would allow Yugito to stay where she is, BUT they would also allow her to do something else as well. The masses are fickle and generally care very little with the dealings of government. As long as they're not suffering and can see prosperity than they tend to be pretty cool with whatever. The masses are meant to be LEAD. All you just have to do is make a convincing case and they will roll with it. You didn't do that though. You just went straight for defection like a peacock proudly displaying how amazing they are......(sigh). That's not a leader cause Naruto didn't even take a single night to consider the fallout. But of course to you, no matter the results, it means nothing in the face of Yugito's optimum happiness.
SIDE NOTE: I can understand Yugito being miserable after she learned how the Raikage really sees her, but she wouldn't be suffering. Is she waking up at night from night terrors? Is her hair turning white from stress? Is she getting seizures? If it's none of that, then how specifically is she suffering? If it's something along the lines of, "she hates her job." Than welcome to the club sister! Cause that's a ton of people, and definitely no reason to nearly start a war.
You give the masses too much credit. The Kumo citizens didn't decide "anything" about Yugito or her station. The Raikage does. He was the one who did it on behalf of his country. The regular people are oblivious to the details of military efforts. They mainly just know when they're at war or if they're in peace. That's it. The Raikage is the leader. The Kumo people are lead by the Raikage. And if Naruto changed the leader of Kumo to a shinobi who's cool with a decision like one of their strongest kunoichi taking an active role in peaceful efforts by the newly reformed Akatsuki, then the people will be as well.Yet Naruto didn't attack the problem head on, did he? Because the problem is Ay, not Yugito's way of ninja.Author's response
I’ve enjoyed the discussion as well, but going forward if you wish to respond, please go to my Deviantart page. I’m not a fan of having my review count bolstered by multiple back and forth replies. Thank you!
Yes, it is. In all the examples that you stated, they all required something first. A person taking action. In order to lose a fight, which I have. You first have to be willing to fight after all. I don’t agree that there are people that can’t defend themselves. There are certainly people that will not defend themselves mainly because they tell themselves the same things you are saying. But, doing nothing only assures you one thing. Failure by default. You can’t be sure a person is going to beat you before you are first willing to challenge them much as the recent Mayfield vs Mcgregor fight. You can assume, and even judge an action as futile. But, that is still losing through inaction. Sure, Mcgregor lost in the end, but he did far better than most people would have expected. The point is he tried. Hell, America was founded by people that had no right beating what at the time was the strongest country. Following your advice it would still be Colonies to the crown. But, they were willing to fight and that is the only way to know if you are going to win or lose. Again, doing nothing guarantees failure. Moreover, if people refuse to act, then they ultimately deserve only what those who do or are in charge will grant them.
Yes, it is hoping because it’s just bad storytelling to say, “Oh Naruto’s by her side so she’s definitely going to be Raikage.” Dairu is clearly Ay’s favorite so wouldn’t it stand to reason that is who would end up as Raikage after Ay.
No, I mean Kumo’s weapon. They know she is a jinchuriki and are fine letting her be one on their behalf. You may not be able to say they own all the Raikage’s faults. But, through their actions and inactions doesn’t he remain in power through them. As to the Shinobi, what makes you so sure they can just retire. I may have portrayed that as being the case in Konoha, but I never said Kumo was a lax when it came to its soldiers. I mean, for all you know it’s similar to North Korea there and see how well it would go for a soldier that just wanted to retire there.
They didn’t know about the flower girl attack until she sprung it. Who said they need to deal with the Prison attack right away? But as soon as they learned of it, they did begin acting right? It did take time to get the pieces in place. You’ve been arguing for doing nothing and let the problem sort itself out. As to Naruto, he may not have thought of the fallout that night. But, he made sure to account for it when he made his plans. The point is that he was willing to do what was right, not hiding behind what might happen if he failed and use that as an excuse for doing nothing.
Wrong, some people want to be lead. But, there are people that want to be free. Freedom requires two things, responsibility and self-reliance. It’s true there are people that want to be taken care from cradle to grave, and if that is the case, then they aren’t worthy of consideration as the only thing they deserve is what they are given. You can’t ask people that strive for more to support those that refuse to support themselves. You can’t ask people to deny what’s in their best interests for people that aren’t willing to act in theirs while hiding behind fears that they don’t think they are good enough. You say they would be fine with Yugito moving on, but wouldn’t they see losing one of their two super weapons as a threat to their security and prosperity. I mean you’re arguing against it pretty hard using the masses as a reason why Naruto shouldn’t have acted. Yet, now you’re turning around stating they would be fine with it.
Yes, because she is being denied freedom of choice. Furthermore, how many people who hate their job were forced into it as a child? I’m pretty sure slaves hated their jobs too. The difference between the people you use as an example and I is yours have a choice to change their lives. You’re arguing that Yugito doesn’t, and she should accept it because people with that freedom are too lazy to improve their situations.
The Raikage is one man, but he is enabled by many thousands. After all, when Hitler was rounding up the Jews what did the German people do. Nothing. A few had the bravery to act to hide them or smuggle them out of the country. But most did nothing as their Jewish neighbors were rounded up and led off to concentration camps. They might not have done it personally, but through their inaction they enabled the man that did.
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